Entropy as the cause of multiples utopias.

Напишано од Skanderbeg, 15.10.2015 at 16:04

Followed him for long time... i even sent him email volunteering my labour - ♥ ty

Напишано од Skanderbeg, 15.10.2015 at 16:04

No thanks, i have no interest in learning to use photoshop. That is for children who like to paint.

What? I had job apllications where photoshop was necessary skill.
I used it mostly for now to photoshop maps for AW...

EDIT: i declined that job offer tho... it was suppose to be in Russia and some guy named Vladimir wanted me to photoshop satellite images or something.

Напишано од Skanderbeg, 15.10.2015 at 16:04

Напишано од Goblin, 15.10.2015 at 14:29

Serb... learn how to use photoshop. That paint svastika is embarassing

No thanks, i have no interest in learning to use photoshop. That is for children who like to paint.

There's a lot of people who make a professional career out of using photoshop, don't knock it til you try it, it's easy to touch up photos and make them look a lot better

Напишано од Goblin, 15.10.2015 at 16:24

EDIT: i declined that job offer tho... it was suppose to be in Russia and some guy named Vladimir wanted me to photoshop satellite images or something.

I hade same job offer too......but i declined.It was suppose to be in Antarctica,some guy named Adolf wanted me to photoshop some UFO,to make them looks like unormal things.....

Напишано од brianwl, 15.10.2015 at 15:45

it's the profit... screws up everything.. if you have to think in terms of money, have money makers (gov/bank) pay you for every person you feed... so you give fruit juices to 1000 people, you get 'credit' for that. If your competitor produces same quality fruit juices, but his workers more motivated for whatever reason, and makes fruit juices for 1500 people, he gets credit for that... he produced more, at same quality. (Maybe his people ♥ feeding people more, so more reward.... maybe they just greedy bastards who work more hours, doesn't matter why.)

Now lets say person you need to feed is far away... like antartica or something... then Antartica Bank gives more money until it's worthwhile to send your juice there... maybe you get 3x as much, since it is more effort to ship there.

Your competitor does the math, and says , wait, i can still get it to antartica for 2x as much (since my workers wanted to vacation there anyway, they volunteered to ship there) hahaha, but anyway, you get my point. If someone can do SAME quality more efficiently, then they can negotiate with that gov/bank.

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But never work cuz people to greedy and just like $$$ the way it is... make more profit if people are starving... they sell there house for a juice box if they starving enough..

You say he gets credit, a reward, but how he gets that reward, in money? in goods like laptop, chairs and doors? Second question: if government/bank reward owners for doing charity - where they get credit/goods from? Someone have to create that in order you to spend it or (re)distribute it?

Government have revenue from collecting taxes (except Arabia and Russia, they get revenue from selling oil), taxes come from people who work and make profit from selling product they worked on. Now if those people work and send that product as a charity, they can't pay taxes, which mean government won't have revenue anymore to spend and award other people who do charity.

Напишано од brianwl, 15.10.2015 at 16:23

Followed him for long time... i even sent him email volunteering my labour - ♥ ty

Excellent, because i have one question which i asked my Communism/Marxism teacher in class - how do we start?

I understand what Fresco meant by saying withdraw money from economy and everyone will prosper, but who will work in factories? Factory owners won't have money to pay workers, so why would worker continue to work in that private factory? Does Fresco meant creating public ownership/collectivism like USSR had so everyone use what they need (from each according to ability to each according to needs)?

Also, i can understand that northern hemisphere will go through reform easier - we have paved roads, electricity, factories, technology. But what will southern hemisphere do, like Africa? They don't have paved roads, electricty or factories, so if you withdrew money, will there be 'law of value'? What will they produce, who will teach them how to produce things they need? For example, when China reformed to free-market in 1978, million of american, german and japanese experts and technicians flooded China to show them how to produce technology, and for that they recieved money (profit-motive).

Fuck,i agree with Tito.

Напишано од Goblin, 15.10.2015 at 16:24

Напишано од Skanderbeg, 15.10.2015 at 16:04

No thanks, i have no interest in learning to use photoshop. That is for children who like to paint.

What? I had job apllications where photoshop was necessary skill.
I used it mostly for now to photoshop maps for AW...

EDIT: i declined that job offer tho... it was suppose to be in Russia and some guy named Vladimir wanted me to photoshop satellite images or something.

Plot Twist : KGB tried to recruit you in the Intel Section to blur satelitte images of Russian Bases , maybe

Напишано од Ghostface, 16.10.2015 at 15:40

Напишано од Goblin, 15.10.2015 at 16:24

Напишано од Skanderbeg, 15.10.2015 at 16:04

No thanks, i have no interest in learning to use photoshop. That is for children who like to paint.

What? I had job apllications where photoshop was necessary skill.
I used it mostly for now to photoshop maps for AW...

EDIT: i declined that job offer tho... it was suppose to be in Russia and some guy named Vladimir wanted me to photoshop satellite images or something.

Plot Twist : KGB tried to recruit you in the Intel Section to blur satelitte images of Russian Bases , maybe

nah,hes too croatian for job like dat....

Напишано од Skanderbeg, 16.10.2015 at 14:12

The credit could be kept in a computer - money is just a digital amount - a number on piece of paper somewhere. So the credit would be the same 'concept' but it's value would tied to production that actually contributes to food production, housing and communications. So now you have a number 'banked' which reflects something of value (feeding people.)

It's not significantly different than what we have now... except with the present accounting everything is debt based. "You OWE me $$$ and can't pay? Well, better prostitute yourself or screw someone else over for it." In a credit based system, you do something of value, and get credit for it.

As you probably know, every major government is in debt. Those in Greece may be the first to truly understand that money has no inherent value... it's simply a digital belief system, and the belief is based on an illusion. When you understand WHO those governments are in debt TO, then you understand the simplicity of how money is created. There's some good youtube videos on it also, but i'm sure you've seen them. I like this one, and the Bank of England finally wrote an article last summer confirming this is exactly what happens (but it's kind of long, as it assumes you have no knowledge (47 min): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zx0vrR2BFp8.

Anyway, once you have a credit system established, it's simply a matter of exchange with those of similar values. Let's say you made your drink boxes, and have your credit, and you neighbour made his bread, and has his credit, so you both have an abundance of bread and juice (thanks to government giving you credit) and you both say, well what what do you want to do now?

And it's the answer to this question that scares the crap out of the present gov/bankers... What would you do after you made your juice boxes? What would you do with your free time if everyone on the planet made their 'insert item here' and all your MATERIAL needs were met? Then what?

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I'm in a western country (canada) and there were no roads here a few hundred years ago. They were constructed over time, and it's sort of comical that the nation didn't go into debt when there was actual work to do... most of canada's debt has come AFTER all the major roads, infrastructure, and factories were already built. (Again, if you understand how money is actually created, this makes sense. But to people who believe what gov/banks tell us about how money works, this should be very incoherent, as we should have gone into debt building all the roads and factories - isn't that what we're asking the developing world to buy into???)

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Fresco is a more 'technological' solution... what i kind of envision, to make it work, is a transition phase where people have to do some grunt work. But in the end, there's nothing a computer can't do for you. Consider 'household cleaning'. Already there are self-cleaning restrooms in use... imagine your entire home though, like it was inside a dishwasher. When you go out, you press a button... all the stuff that can't get wet is wall mounted.. the wall rotates, the cleaning jets come out, clean the room, dry it, the house is spotless... no manual labour.

We already have the technology to replace nearly every job currently being done, and i think that was his vision... everyone just has total 'free time' to explore, learn, evolve themselves as they feel fit. He wants all people to be released from the bondage of boring jobs. i think there's a lot of people that NEED boring jobs, so i'd be ok with people choosing to stay in their boring jobs, provided its their choice.

Напишано од brianwl, 16.10.2015 at 19:46

And it's the answer to this question that scares the crap out of the present gov/bankers... What would you do after you made your juice boxes? What would you do with your free time if everyone on the planet made their 'insert item here' and all your MATERIAL needs were met? Then what?

Ah, i understand now. I did understood Fresco's advanced technology, but couldn't comprehend resource(credit)-based economy. Thank you.

Interesting, about free time. I guess i would be studying more, there are too many good books and too little time to read them all. With automation, i can have more free time to spend working on myself, improving, learning, becoming better.

It is interesting it doesn't ask for time to be developed like other ideologies ('work for better future'), it's just 'do it for better now'.